Dundee gangs in the 70's came up with a unique way of displaying which housing scheme they came from - by wearing jerseys of different colours.
Most of these high V-neck jersey's were made at the Knitting & Sewing Centre in Victoria Road.
The design consisted of 1 main broad band across the chest and arms, with a pocket on the top left of the chest in inverted colours, and 2 thin bands around the waist, cuffs & collar.
As time went by, customised variants would be seen, such as pockets on the upper arms, initials on the pockets, and anything up to 5 bands around the waist & cuffs.
In addition, most gangs usually wore the colours in their opposite layout, like for example, as well as a blue jersey with black band, they'd have a black jersey with a blue band. A bit like having a home & away strip.
There were also cardigan versions of the concept.
Although this gang knitwear was exclusively Dundee based, the designs were an adaptation of the high V-neck jersey worn by Steve Ellis, singer with 60's band Love Affair, Fred Perry 60's cyclist shirts and American Varsity College cardigans UK Mods wore in the 60's.
The V-neck jersey's above are - TODDY (Douglas), MID (Mid Craigie), HUNS (Kirkton), MOB (Beechwood), SHAMS (Fintry), FLEET (Lochee).
The cardigans are - HUNS (Hilltown), SHAMS (Whitfield), PAK (Ardler), YMB (St Mary's), HULA (Linlathen), SHADE (upper Hilltown).
These examples are just a small selection of who was wearing what back then.
Click on the images to enlarge/download.
I HAD A SHAMS TANK TOP.I WORE IT ONCE IN DOUGLAS AND WAS SHIT SCARED.MIND YOU, ANY ELEVEN YEAR OLD WOULD BE SHIT SCARED IN A PLACE LIKE THAT.
ReplyDeleteI THOUGHT THE HILLTOON HUNS WAS GREEN WITH A BLACK STRIPE.
HH were green & black, the one in the picture though is Kirkton Huns.
ReplyDeleteWhat was the GOURDIE TROOPS charlston ? I'm only 30. But the older lads then me in the 40s ish called themselves the charlston rowdies then the lads may age roughly 30/37 say whent bk to the YGT llf madness ayy I was on reddit the other day saying about old Dundee gangs n ther jumpers . Also says to read Gangs Of Dundee by Garry Robertson
DeleteI HAD NEVER HEARD OF THE KIRKTON HUNS.I MUST HAVE HAD A SHELTERED UPBRINGING.
ReplyDeleteNever heard of the Kirkton Huns you must have been blind, deaf and dumb, we ran the show.
ReplyDeleteThe Kirkton ran but not the show. Yer.
DeleteAye... ran bein the operative. Bolted!!
DeleteIn the 1950s mockingly referred as the Kirkton Cowboys....
DeleteThe Captain here posting btw....
ReplyDeleteThis thread reminds me of a wee 'incident' I had of an evening myself at a bus stop in Fintry after visiting a friend then living on the estate in the late 70's. As an out-of-towner I'd bought what was prolly a Fleet gang jumper if I recall based on pics above - just bought it coz i liked the colour of it - and then found myself surrounded by a group of the local neds on the way home who couldn't quite understand why I wasn't running scared at the very sight of them... and that my face just wasn't familiar to them...nor my accent Dundonian...... Their 'leader' - I knew he was the leader as he didn't slur and appeared to have a few active brain cells to his name that didn't reek of glue - said 'Do you live here? And then 'do you want to die here'? as his opening lines of interrogation....... 0_0 - anyways, once they realised that the jumper was an innocent 'mistake' they left me alone and actually went off laughing after I told their leader that I'd actually been sent with a message from Danny in the Bash Street Kids saying they wanted their jumpers back...... ;)
Incidentally around that time the late singer Billy McKenzie gave me both a horrified look and a free t-shirt to wear during a visit to his clothes shop wearing same jumper as we had to go through the Hulltoon area together... lol
Young Napper Tamson says,
ReplyDeleteI was a member of the young Fintry Shams, well at least I believed I was, I never actually signed a contract ha ha with Davy Young who was the Guv'nor of Fintry.We had developed our own jumper and if my memory serves me right, it was the opposite colour i.e. Red with a black stripe. Anyone who "Ran' with me or away with me!! then would remember that in 1973/4 I had the best Bowie haircut in Dundee no question and it cost me a fortune at Raymond Smiths the barber Dura St.(Sweeney Todd) from my paper money earned at Carberry Crescent (Anybody remember my Red Chopper) every week. Memories forever.Magic
I thought the Hulltoon Huns were white with red stripe?.......
ReplyDeletethe hulltoon had all the jerseys first coz they had all the knitting shops then the robbers fae the schemes took the ones they wanted
ReplyDeleteIt was me and me 2 friends that stated the gang jumpers and yes we were HH for we stater them at the Notting shop beside the Hilton Clock 👍
DeleteWe were in the shop with the woman setting up the Patern I was 14 and now 70 now
Deletethe hulltoon were green and black, the only problem with that gang was there were only about 20 of them and they were always hanging about the chipper over from the hilltoon clock.but for me the main gangs were the kirkton huns and the lochee fleet the rest could not fight thar way oot o a paper bag like the douglas toddy or the fintry shams,ha ha up the huns ya bass
ReplyDeleteNever came into Whitfield tho,aye ?
DeleteI lived in Broughty Ferry by Dawson Park in about 1972-73. It was a Friday night and had just left the scout hut in Broughty Ferry to go home. My mate and I was at the bus stop when a load of Douglas Toddy or Ferry Fleat gang members turned up and saw us in our uniforms.. They kicked fuck out of my mate (can picture it now in 2019)We decided to walk home without saying a word.. When we got to our estate he broke down as he was in so much pain
DeleteHi there .do you remember the Ferry Fleat jumpers colour's ?
DeleteFerry wine and light blue
DeleteFerry was posh n that but Main man in ferry (barnhill) was Peter white - wee brother of knocker white - no’ too many fancied a go wi Peter - Kerr included. Grew up fighting wi knocker so not much scared him!
DeleteAll you tosspots are bletherin a load o shite!
ReplyDeleteThe top crew in Dundee was the LINLATHEN HULA!!
We used to regularly kick fuck oot o the Fintry Shambles, and when we went to Kirkton, the Huns would shite it!
HULA ROOL YA BASS!!!!!!
The hula boys were a bunch o losers it were the mid boys that ran the show
DeleteHula boys suck their own dogs FLEET ROOL
DeleteHula? You got to laugh. They shindigs couldn't even walk across pitkerro Rd into mid. Belters nvr won a fight in their lives. Pmsl.
DeleteHula Hoops ;) haha wooden hooses haha Gon Yersel
DeleteMy mate even 2 this day was the leader of the Kirkton huns prob in the 70s.and went on to be one of the main men in dundee.prob still is
DeleteYKH#1💛💙
DeleteHula Boyz Topman Rite Here JASON CHAN Born N Bread Still The RunninThw
Deletebeechy boys kicked shit out of all u twats y-mob rule ya bass
ReplyDeleteha ha :)
Deletemob rule
Deletehulltoon huns ran the show in the 80s coondo gander bellzo there top boys n they did all the fightn at football bfr the casuals came along
ReplyDeleteGander was a beast,we all know what he did to at least 3 women, should've been locked up and key thrown away
Deleteye u rite mate wldnt say h huns were hard but were all game as fuck n did the fistys at the soccer 2
ReplyDeleteglesgay cunts cana fite always need blades shitehouses dundee fistys ya bass
ReplyDeletedid george kerr lead the hula in the 80s? did mid n linlathen form 2 b the hula?
ReplyDeleteNot sure about the 80's but the mid and Hula were always close as we went to the same schools. Mid Primary and the catholic school cant remember it's name , And most went to the stobie.. Us the Hulla and the Hilltoon huns
DeleteMid and Linlathen have never joined up as far as i know. Mr Kerr is from Mid and ran all of Dundee no just the we fannys from Linlathen. Mid rule. YMR
DeletePS the other school was St Vincents and it was a linlathen school its on the wrong side of Pitkerro road to be a mid school
DeleteGeorge was in the mid. We didn't have a leader though. Didn't need one. George is t the only cunt who could fight. Hula never rolled with us either that would defeat the purpose
DeleteHula n mid were close but Kerr was mid, Jason chan ran hula n still is there top boy
DeleteHi fellow Scots, in Austalia in the 1970s Sharpies began wearing Contes which are similar to the Jerseys worn in Dundee at around the same time, is there a link or coincidence? There are many of us interested in info history or even better pictures. FB site Sharpies, Sharps & Skins a 1960-1970's Melbourne Subculture
ReplyDeletewhere could i buy a top like these today?
ReplyDeleteshams will allways b no1 gander and co remember caird park when uz all got ur bostal uz ran like all the rest ysr
ReplyDeletecannie buy them jerseys any more the shop on victoria road closed down years ago,think its a pakistanie shop now,and i ken the pakistanies sell most things but i dont think they sell gang jerseys
ReplyDeleteIn my day the uniform of the "hun" was a green adidas trackie top with the black 3 strips on the arms and the double h's in pen on the back and flicking toddy sign as we passed on the no. 26 bus lol. Not sure if that was Late 80's or early 90's
ReplyDeleteLoad of bollocks on here.Lochee Fleet ran the toon.Oor territory run fae Charlestion,Menzieshill,Lochee,Poley,Dryburgh,The Blackie,Pentland,and had affiliated gangs within it like the Gourdie Troop,Menzieshill Boot Boys,Dryburgh Mad Squad,The Charleston Crazy Tongs.The combined fleet was massive and regularly cleared oot the pussy Hilltoon,the Nomark Shams and pulverised the Minks fae Beechy
ReplyDelete123 who are we,we're the boys that rule Dundee.With an F and an L and a Double EE T..Lochee Fleet rule all Dundee.
;-)
Dinna be a fucking idiot we were sick o chasing u bunch o fannys every week canny fight shit MOB RULE YOU BUNCH O PRICKS
DeleteWas in poley and wee always got a hand from all the lochee boys menie Charlston boys it was class cause wen people would come across thinking wee were a tiny crew and be running instantly cause wee could call on so many boys lochee defo had the best fighters like ypmsr
DeleteAndy rettie ran the show, no cunt came close to him, he went about splattering every cunt back in the 80s ;)
ReplyDeleteAye, and the 90s too....
DeleteNot every one. That would be around the same time as a Mr Higgins lead the kirkton huns
DeleteIf we are talking about gangs then lochee wins hands down it was to big there were to many schemes merged together but if we are talking about individuals then you are right Andrew Rettie tops them all, 'the rocket' i think he got called lol because of his speed
ReplyDeletenone could lace colin higgins boots, he would have smashed them all
DeleteBoon, animal, wee animal,forgot a lot of the older boys names
DeleteKirkton huns wore blue jumpers with yellow band even bairns in prams had them lol those were the days
ReplyDeleteThey were just Polly bags Fae the chippy
DeleteThe hula had a small crew but we were game. Hula means (hu)nnygreen and lin(la)then together or have u lot anytime if you want the make up version. I know you spell honey like this but in oarie Dundee its spelt wi a U.
ReplyDeleteA name from the past .. The Hula ran alright away most of the time sYb
DeleteIn the early 90s everbody used to go to the t-shirt shop at the top of the Well gate in the food court bit I remember being in and and a cpl o boy from hilltoon came in asking if the guy Billy could wip him up a few green and black tshirts striped like freddys jumper so I'm sure Hilltown was green and black
DeleteI heard hula stands 4, huge unstoppable linlathen army, Jason Chan is there top boy n still is, has hula tattooed on his stomach but he made his own meaning, heavy untouchable linlathen assassin
DeleteI had a Whitfield Shams jersey in 1980 that I bought off my "berry money". At that time, I recall that the stripe on the left sleeve wasn't a solid stripe but was actually two bands.
ReplyDeleteThe colours were seawitch blue and white which were taken from the Co-op sign, as this was the main shop at Whitfield "shopping centre".
Used to spend the entire summer holidays fighting with the Toddy, Mid or Fintry. Easter bank holiday was always a big kick off at Cairdie.
A couple of years later, I was in the Stobie and we used to all go to an under 18's disco at Junction 9 in the town centre. There were Lochee, Poley, Fintry, Whitfield and Hulltoon boys there, but we generally all got on, and it very rarely all went off. (Mind you, when it did go off........).
One incident I do recall is when I was walking through Beechy (no colours on, obviously), and the phone started ringing as I went past the phone box. I went in and answered it, to tell whoever it was that they were actually ringing a phone box.
Never got a chance to say anything, as the person at the other end said "You're f*****g dead you Stobie b*****d!"
I was out that phone box quicker than Usain Bolt.
Great days.
Does anyone else remember where other gangs got their colours from?
RETURNING AS AN EXPAT (DE-EMIGRATED SCHOOL BOY) BACK TO DUNDEE HAVING SPENT NEARLY 6 YEARS IN THE CITY OF SYDNEY, I THOUGHT THAT DUNDEE WAS COMPLETELY DIFFERENT TO THE LIFE AND LIFESTYLE OF SYDNEY. IT WAS VERY CONFUSING AND I STILL CAN'T UNDERSTAND WHY THESE TWO CITIES ARE SO DIFFERENT. SYDNEY WITH ALMOST 6,000,000 PEOPLE AND DUNDEE 155,000 PEOPLE, MAYBY THERE WAS NOTHING ELSE TO DO. AFTER NEARLY 40 YEARS BACK IN DUNDEE, I STILL THINK I AM LIVING IN A 1972 TYPE DUNDEE, WHICH IS VERY COMFORTING TO KNOW THAT DUNDEE STICKS TO ITS TRADITIONS AND SYDNEY IS STILL SYDNEY.
ReplyDeleteRE Willsharp's comment.
ReplyDeleteThat was really interesting seeing Aussies in the 70's wearing hooped gang jerseys similar to those worn in Dundee.
I'm quite amazed!!
I don't even recall seeing any anywhere else in Scotland, never mind further afield!
Wonder how that came about?
Was it the result of someone emigrating to Australia from Dundee and continuing the fashion fad down under, or was there some kind of parallel evolution taking place in 70's youth culture??!!
One for historians and anthropologists to look into!.
Thanks for passing the info on.
GG
Jack Flash and John Smith ran the Kirkton Huns even from London
Deletein the late 70s early 80s
remember a lady in dens rd market made the gang jerseys too.also made similiar cardies in utd and dundee colours too.
ReplyDeletefond memories.
YWSR ya bass
Forever clearing the YKH in caird park selwin and that Young mains fleet ya bass
ReplyDeleteThe thing we up in whitfield did is when we beat some poor cxxt up from another scheme, we took their jersey off them as a trophy, I will always remenber one friday night at the whitfield shops I saw Big scotty wi a fintry jersey on, tam blair wi a toddy jersey on, eck tolan wi a kirton top on norry webster wi a mid jersey on and shug mcglaughlin wi a fleet top on I had to laf cos it looked funny as feck, that young Whitfield lot were mental but a good bunch of lads pretty naughty lads but a good bunch, and they looked after each other and anybody else who got into bother fea whitfield, scotty, riddle, tolan, mckay, dullis, wilson, oreilley
ReplyDeleterip boys what a team Y W S rule.
ah nice post with some great whitfield names (legends)
ReplyDeleteand the ones that are no longer with us will always be remembered, along with the lads from other schemes who are lost to us, even tho we were all enemys in the past we all had the same thing in common we loved our parish and oor gang and we were all fae dundee never forgotten
Whitfield Shams Were All Poofters. Mental MID Rools
ReplyDeletedoes anybody remember rabi from the mains fleet forever chasing the kirton out of cairdy
ReplyDeletena cant remember him who was he?
ReplyDeleteFleet Rule
ReplyDeleteWAIT CORRECT ME IF IM WRONG BUT IM JUST WONDERING THAT KIRKTON HUNS WS THE MOST VIOLENT GNG IN DUNDEE WHILE LOCHEE FLEET WAS THE MOST GROWING GANG IN DUNDEE AND IFF YOU WERE ONE OF THOSE JUMPERS IN ANOTHER PLACE IN DUNDEE YOU WOULD GET BATTERED LIKE HELL AND WHERE IS HULLTOON HUNS JUMPER
ReplyDeleteColin Higgins was the Governor from the 70's and propably still is, never been beaten
ReplyDeleteNot in Andy rettie or Colin craigies league
DeleteHiggins #1
DeleteMy father and his brother ran with the Kirkton Huns, the two Smitty's. They went around with Dragon and Knocker White. Knocker wanted to be top man so he went with Colin Higgins on a bus to the middle of nowhere for a square go. Colin beat him so badly, Knocker had to pretend to be dead so he'd leave him alone. Spent weeks in hospital after that. No one challenged him again.
DeleteWas it ian and graham smith?
DeleteOriginally from st.Mary's.
Yes my Dad was Graham
DeleteSHADE rule ya bass!
ReplyDeleteGod bless the mental Shade fae Farfar
DeleteTODDY RULE
ReplyDeleteIt's no secret that the Lochee Fleet were dundees biggest and most notorious gang throughout the 70's & 90's.
ReplyDeleteThe Kirkton huns & The Beechie mob also deserve a mention but the rest don't even come close.
What about the 80’s?
DeleteLochee Mad Squad.... Clockwork Orange
Deletefleet fuck all came over to the hulltoo n once in 5 yrs hulltoo always in lochee lookn for it
DeleteOne day while at Dundee Sheriff Court meh Mither beeing there to see her Son who was up for petrol bombing took her coat off - she never knew she had a Lochee Fleet Jumper on - it was just the Son's jersey -She sat through trial without knowing and no one even told her
ReplyDeleteLol🤣
DeleteYoung Springy The a tributary of the Stobie Huns fucked off anyone that came wandering around Baxtrs Park ! Paddy Muffet and his minky incest brothers, Bellzo fae ra Hulltoon never came doon, Eugene Ritchie fae ra LFleet couldn'y afford the bus fare Russel Dear (age 9) run the Hulla oot a toon an the Fintry Shams rooled by a Paki lol nuff said junkie fuck n the Beechie Mob so Smart so one man team and to the starter of all Kirkton Huns i lay my hat off as they brought drugs to the toon Fuck the heroin has just kicked in
ReplyDeleteJohnny R and Gaucho and Paul B sYb
DeleteCamperdown Park 1982/3 Easter weekend ?
ReplyDeleteWhat happened?
DeleteAll the scheme gangs congregated up Camperdoon park, the wee gangs joining up with the big 4 or 5 for a rammy. As I remember all that happened was getting chased fae the polis !!
DeleteTroop/Toddy rule Dundee fuck the shams Hun's fleet and the rest Toddy Troop rule YGTR ya bunch of fannys 123 who are we w are the boys who rule Dundee with a TODD DDY toddy boys will never die ya fannys we will kick fuck out o all of you a now like Dylan Blaney and John scullion haha we would fold them all YGTR / TODDY and Troop rule funded it is 2@@16 & we will fold all the YWS and the K huns and Fleet haha belters who rule toddy troop rule YGTR
ReplyDeleteQuick question the old mans 50th is coming up and always tells me stories about this so was wondering what wer the mid colours? Thought it would go with all the books I got for him etc
ReplyDeleteThe Mid wore green jerseys with a red (sometimes orange) hoop, as in the illustration above.
ReplyDeleteGreen and red
DeleteWho were the west end gang then
ReplyDeleteThe west end gang. They were the toughest gang in dundee. Nae cunt messed with them
DeleteOh aye. The west end gang. Tough bastards like.
ReplyDeletefleet rule
ReplyDeletenames tyler martin!!!!! kirkton huns rule ya daftys
ReplyDeleteYgtr mon the troop fuck the rest gourdy is the best
ReplyDeleteI grew up in 70s , The maddest gangs were K.Huns, Hultoon Huns, Mid, Beechie, Lochee fleet, were OK but only cause half Dundee, fought with them, Menziehill, Charleston, Dryburugh, all joined with Lochee, although they had there own jumpers, but Kirkton was and is No. 1, even in the jail, the weegies , everyone knows kirkton Huns.
ReplyDeleteAlright shaggers
ReplyDeleteTroop rule bunch of sausages
ReplyDeleteWest end fleet rule
ReplyDeletekirkton huns 1960 to forever
ReplyDeleteHi guys.
ReplyDeleteAround 1971/72 we had a few Dundee (Mental Mid) lads move down here to Burnley for the work. Bob Barber, Gilbert "Gobby" Young & a couple more...Fergie and Jimmy, can't remember their last names.
Fergie..Raymond Ferguson , always had his wee dog Blue with him.
DeleteRight head banger, made me carry a big bayonet into the YM for him one night.
good lads they were. Hung around Burnley for quite a few years and joined our crew at the time The Flying Wheel Skins. Fergie was a bit of a nutter, we also had our top lad who`s name was Joe Ferguson.
DeleteGreat to read all the above.
2 the tool that was on aboot gander getn borstal ye the hulltoon took a hit that nite but u fintry pricks had at least 60 goys iwas 15 at the time n ran but rmbr gander coondo kendo standn n there was only 17 of us went 2 the carnival that nite retty 80s never heard oh him lochee fuck all n till they schemes joind up
ReplyDeleteBack in the 50s gangs didnae hae daft names. we jist went beh the names oh whaur we cam fae: lochee, west port, hulltoon, midcraigie, marryat, etc. Lochee wiz the top mob, then the port, while the ithers were jist oor punchbags.
DeleteGander was a beast,women weren't safe around him
DeleteHi, wonder if any one can help? I'm doing a wee magazine as part of my last year at uni. Its on fashion subcultures from the teddy boys right through, but I want to put a bit about Dundee in it. Really interested in the knitted jumpers and been reading Gary Robertsons book Gangs of Dundee. Would love if anyone had any good information, cool stories, good pictures or just anything you think would be worth telling me about the jumpers or just the times back then. any help would be much appreciated. comment on this or drop me a wee message lyndseycurrie-@Hotmail.co.uk thanks!
ReplyDeleteSounds Good 😁
DeleteDid you manage to get any/much info?
DeleteI moved from kirkton to hilltown in 1970 with my mates ,the McDermott's , where we started the Hulltoon Huns.
ReplyDeleteQuite a few guys soon joined up with some real roasters onboard.
The Phinn's, the Lewis's, Jackson's etc. meant you had to be wary of your own guys.
A lot of infighting meant a lot of serious shit happening which ended that regime's reign which would never be the same with the newer ones coming in.
Toddy rule fuck yis all
ReplyDeleteArbroath ya bass
ReplyDeleteanyone in Dundee in the 90’s Ken’s Blackness mafia ran the show, 123 wha r we, were the boys wha rule Dundee, wi a B L A C K I E, black and proud and fuck the dee
ReplyDeletelol belter were u even a gang HH derry rhumba
Deletehere its rab I'm the current generation n ill tell use all right now that toth rule simple as that any yis got anything to say we'll go old skl bare knuckle brawl like back in the day toth#1
ReplyDeleteDryburgh in the 80s
ReplyDeleteGetn stoned
Fk the lot of ya
Eddie stater mom made the fleet jumpers
ReplyDeletePentland
hulltoon huns 79
ReplyDeleteListen to all yous still thinking you've got it those days have passed and gone forever we will never see the likes again, all I can say is they were the best days off my life fighting with every other scheme in the toon we will never see these days again just a good memory now and a thing to remember good days gone never to return . Dave McQueen grim Whitfield in the 80s and 90s lost a good few mates rip war
ReplyDeleteJings, you've booted some brain cells in mah heid, great memories scrapping in the toon, then off to Club Foot or Junction 9 & dancin to two tone with the same people we were scrapping lol
DeleteStill have many friends from schemes afar, lol YHHR ya bass,.
Great post thanks.
Ywsr
ReplyDelete